MEETING DR. BROWN

[htmagic]

Folks,

I just pointed out something that didn't compute. Linda, although I agree with you about your dad sending in money to maintain his license, much of the time he was dealing with Washington, D.C. so he could have obtained a D.C. license.

But if Dr. Brown really was a licensed engineer, there would be a paper trail that would be hard to hide. And Linda, if he did have a license, you would have run across it in his papers. I have to renew my license every two years and it is probably similar for other states. If your Dad was a licensed engineer and obtained his license through D.C., most states have a reciprocal agreement and would have granted him a license in the state he applied to. As long as he sent in his application and the necessary funds.

Mark, you're probably right about "making a mistake" but as a researcher that would be an obviously big boo boo. I never saw that photo of Dr. Brown before and I wonder if Rho took it himself?

I was just surprised that someone referred to Thomas Townsend Brown (TTB) as a P.E. It is one thing to call him "Dr. Brown" out of respect, but another to call him a licensed engineer.

As for the "pepper", Mikado, I hadn't given the book a thorough study so I cannot comment on that. Since you didn't provide specifics, I do not know why you say it has a flavor in places that just doesn't taste right. I cannot comment on that as I didn't study it intensely. But if the author can't even get the fact that TTB wasn't a PE, then I suppose he wouldn't get technical facts straight either.

But look at the bright side of things, Mikado. At least whale oil is 60% cheaper than it was this summer!

MagicBill

[Linda Brown]

Magic Bill,

You said " much of the time he was dealing with Washington, D.C. so he could have obtained a D.C. license.

But if Dr. Brown really was a licensed engineer, there would be a paper trail that would be hard to hide. And Linda, if he did have a license, you would have run across it in his papers"

I will leave that for Paul to answer, I think. <g> Linda

[greggvizza]

What possible need would TT Brown have had for a PE license? Would someone go thorough all that testing and expense if they were never going to need the license? Think of all the engineers in the electronic industry, like the folks at Motorola that design the cell phones and the engineers at Intel that design the microprocessors. I would bet that hardly any of them have PE licenses, and the ones that do probably obtained them while working in another industry. These types of engineers don’t need a PE license to do their jobs. Where it is needed is in the building and construction industries to be able to stamp drawings. I don’t see where TTB would have had the time to bother with it.

GV

[Linda Brown]

Magic Bill,
You mentioned this and I have a question.

"In fact,there is a nice photograph of your father in the book (Pg. 32) which can be found here:
http://d.scribd.com/docs/2b1ygjq00pi8igvx1j4w.pdf

Can you describe that picture for me? If it is of Dad with a pen in his hand, pointing to a disc in his hand .....( Dad is dressed very nicely in a dark suit) ... if it is that one ( for some reason I can't open that link! darn!) Anyway... if it happens to be that picture ... That was taken by my Mother, used I think in the big article in an Intelle paper ... perhaps Paul is more familiar with that and can give you the specifics.

My Mother kept that photograph on her dresser set in an English leather frame. I still have that somewhere here. I always thought that it was interesting that the leather on the bottom is intentionally large enough to sort of self crop the picture. Anyone looking at it just in passing would think that it was a very nice shot of my Dad taking notes or something. Very businesslike ... sort of typical of him at work and I think that was one of the reasons she loved it so. But no one could see the way that it was cropped that if you took the picture out of that frame you could see clearly that he was pointing to a model of one of his smaller flying discs.

Is that the shot? If not ... can you kind of describe it to me. I probably know it.

Oh, and another outside thought. Regarding that PE title. I think the only time that Dad would have dealt with something that needed any kind of " construction license" would have been in the thirties while he was working building some sort of a breakwater on Lake Erie for I think a government program at the time. Other than that it was mainly electronics for him.

And Rolfs book was written originally in Germany ... so would that title have meant something a little different to him in that country?

Thanks, Linda

[Trickfox]

Can you describe that picture for me? If it is of Dad with a pen in his hand, pointing to a disc in his hand

.....( NO) but here it is so that you can see for yourself

[htmagic]

Thank you Trickfox for posting the photo.
Linda, I'm not saying your Dad had a PE license. I think Rolf was "essentially correct" in his facts.

A PE license is used for certifying drawings and also in private consulting. And your Dad did a lot of consulting.
But I thought I thought it was odd that someone that had this photograph and some of the same details of his early life (that I skimmed from the book) as what Paul wrote in his book would have an error such as this. Since I don't know if your Dad reviewed the copy before it was published, I cannot comment.

As for the PDF file, it didn't open for me the first time either. I had to refresh the page (F5) or (Cntl + F5) a time or two and then it loaded.

I need some time to review the book more thoroughly but I will be in the midst of a move. As a result of the poor economy, my task here in Maryland ended and right now I'm on overhead. (Not a good situation for a contractor.) But I saw this coming and luckily accepted another position doing real engineering. But it is in Tennessee. My wife (Kimberly) and I talked about it and she and our daughter (Danielle) will stay in Maryland until Danielle graduates in 2010. So we will be apart except for the times when they come down or I come up there. Not an easy situation. But the pay will be much better and (hopefully) so will the opportunity to practice real engineering. I have done this in the past with my previous job to the one I have now but at least then I was only gone 2-3 weeks before the company sent me back home to be with the family on their dime. It is different when you have to pay for it yourself. But a man has to support their family and Kim always wanted to come back to TN anyway as that is where her family is. So I will be packing over Thanksgiving and will start in December.

I hope once I'm settled to be able to finish some of these projects I started...

MagicBill

[Mikado14]

Wish you luck in your endeavors Mr. Magic.

It is not the job that demeans the man but the man that demeans the job.

Engineering is engineering and the satisfaction of figuring out a bracket to trip a whisker switch or a complex switching circuit, a set of steps or a spiral staircase, or a flame jet generator or a blow torch, the satisfaction of any task should be the same for a true engineer.

Best of Luck in your seperation,

Mikado

[Linda Brown]

Oh! Thats so tough being separated like that but I do admire you for giving your daughter the chance to stay in one school. Dad did that for me, the last two years of highschool... which for him I think was probably a great sacrifice. Where you are finding it difficult to be apart from your family he probably found it difficult to stay just in one place with us... but I still appreciate the effort.

And as for your new home... Tennessee is a gorgeous state. Ask Paul.

Thankyou Trickfox for that photo ... I have to confess to being a little confused. That photo was in the Schaffranke article? If so then it was diffeerent than the book I have , which I think predates that article. I remember seeing that photo in a little booklet called the " Psychic Observer".... In any case ... I had to smile because whoever took that picture was a professional photographer I guess working for that magazine because I have other proofs from that session ... ( others which I actually like much better.) I am not sure when those photos were taken exactly but I remember that jacket. It was a leather western cut jacket that Dad bought in San Francisco the weekend of September 15th 1967. < g> I was with him then and Dad was going quite " western" under the influence of the desert and his Odlum meetings .... the Bolo tie he is wearing there was a gift from Odlum actually and Dad enjoyed the simplicity of it , I think.

All my little asides don't help answer some of the other questions regarding the article or why Schaffranke used PE... but its all I got!!! Linda

[Mikado14]

Thankyou Trickfox for that photo ... I have to confess to being a little confused. That photo was in the Schaffranke article? If so then it was diffeerent than the book I have , which I think predates that article. I remember seeing that photo in a little booklet called the " Psychic Observer"....

Ok, Ms Brown, I have to ask this. Your Father was interviewed by the "Psychic Observer". What was the article about? SRI? Flying discs?

I sit here and wonder if your Father gave the interview as more mud in the water.

Mikado

[Linda Brown]

Mikado,

By muddying the water" do you think that Dad might have engaged in a little " disinformation" in this direction? Thats entirely possible. I think it depends on what was at stake at that time.

One of his favorite expressions to me ( and it takes some understanding of OLD Navy practices to understand it. " Blow smoke... and steam in another direction." I guess nobody can do that anymore really but those old "tin cans" used to be able to lay down a curtain of smoke that was next to impossible to see through. Of course thats when everybody had to depend on field glasses!~

This is an interesting post ( note how old it is!)

https://www.ttbrown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=24#p24

I have come to believe ( and I think that the evidence has convinced others......) that the " Philadelphia Experiment" was a carefully crafted disinformation campaign.

I think that Nick Cook touched on his hunch that was true but he never really investigated it. At any rate .... when was THAT story being " blown out of the stacks"? and when also did Rho Sigma start writing about Dad? Its odd that Dad would stage an interview with ANYONE. Out of his standard operations! Unless he had a purpose.

as the main body of information unfolds in the Philadelphia Experiment the reader finds that it was wrapped carefully around that single chapter called the " Force Fields of Townsend Brown. Perhaps it does what it was supposed to do and what it accomplished ...was to forever link Dads name with something that was so fantastic that it was easy to discount what others may have decided to say about him.

As with all good disinformation .. there were portions of it I am sure that were "dead on ".... What I think now might have been " controlled release of information" reaching the surface. Then the Philadelphia Experiment comes along and a researcher as qualified as Nick Cook makes the statement that ( because of TPX) " I wouldn't touch Brown with a barge pole." then the entire operation has probably been worth it.

Interesting thoughts anyway. Linda

[htmagic]

<SNIP>

This is an interesting post ( note how old it is!)

https://www.ttbrown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=24#p24

I have come to believe ( and I think that the evidence has convinced others......) that the " Philadelphia Experiment" was a carefully crafted disinformation campaign.

I think that Nick Cook touched on his hunch that was true but he never really investigated it. At any rate .... when was THAT story being " blown out of the stacks"? and when also did Rho Sigma start writing about Dad? Its odd that Dad would stage an interview with ANYONE. Out of his standard operations! Unless he had a purpose.

<SNIP>
Interesting thoughts anyway. Linda

Linda,

Thank you for you well wishes. And thanks to the others for the well wishes. My move will not be easy but I think it will be best for the family and those involved.

And thank you for the early post. I was most interested in the post by Khatgar below the link you gave.

https://www.ttbrown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=51#p51

His website is still up and that is amazing in itself after 4 years. His thoughts on gravity are interesting and may be valid. He talks about rings and I saw the "wheel within a wheel" as recorded in Ezekiel and I also saw shades of the Nazi Bell in his theories. I noticed no one commented on his website and I would like to hear what others think about his math. I would be especially interested in Mikado's and Trickfox's thoughts on his theories. They have a good way of blowing away the "smoke" (military term - obscurants) away from the craft...

MagicBill
P.S. Linda, Rho's book was copyrighted 1977.

[Linda Brown]

Magic Bill,

I think that you and I may be referencing two different books. Which is the one that was copy written in 1977? " Ether-Technology"? The book that I happen to have ( and have been looking for to refresh my memory was published in Germany ... most of it was about Dads work but it was earlier I think. This is interesting and maybe we should just throw a red flag down here for future clarification.

I always wondered why someone would write about Dad in a booklet entitled " Psychic Observer" so obviously I have some studying to do! Linda

[Rose]

Congratulations, Magic. A secure job is a very good thing to have right now, even with the very large drawback.

I can't help with the Psychic Observer mystery, but as to the PE issue, PE does not always indicate that someone is a licensed engineer. It is often simply a job title for both engineering and quasi-engineering positions in certain companies.

rose

[htmagic]

Congratulations, Magic. A secure job is a very good thing to have right now, even with the very large drawback.

I can't help with the Psychic Observer mystery, but as to the PE issue, PE does not always indicate that someone is a licensed engineer. It is often simply a job title for both engineering and quasi-engineering positions in certain companies.

rose

Rose,

I am an engineer and PE means Professional Engineer. They are licensed through the state. For someone to use those initials after their name and not be licensed is fraud and could carry penalties for the person using it if caught. The other PEs will turn in the person using the fake title as they had to work hard (and take a VERY hard exam) to earn that title. It is like an accountant using CPA and not actually passing the test or a doctor using MD and not passing the exams. The State takes a very dim view of that...

I do not believe Thomas Townsend Brown ever used "PE" after his name as this would be misleading and he knew better. Rho Sigma that wrote the book Ether Technologies in 1977 that I referred to was obviously mistaken. As I said before, Rho was "essentially correct."

MagicBill

[Rose]

All i can tell you, Magic is that although I do not have an engineering degree, I have held a position with the title of principal engineer, not by my choice, but because that was the job classification within the company.

Of course, that was twenty five years ago, but even now, if you read the want ads for PE positions, the licensure requirement is not always specified.

rose