Chapter 35 - Something Changed

Use this section for any discussion specifically related to the chapters posted online of the unfolding biography, "Defying Gravity: The Parallel Universe of T. Townsend Brown
Paul S.
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Chapter 35 - Something Changed

Post by Paul S. »

Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
Victoria Steele
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A boy! oh boy!

Post by Victoria Steele »

Paul,

You certainly will never have to wear the mantle of someone who has not done his homework. Your references in this chapter are WONDERFUL!
BUT ON THE PERSONAL SIDE, THEY HAD A BOY!

Now that means a heck of alot to anyone out there who has been closely following the story of this young couple. You had mentioned earlier that this pretty young wife had lost a baby some time earlier so now look what they have. A handsome young father with this bundle in his arms (like alot of young fathers .... not really sure what to do with it, is it going to Pee on him? or what? I love that photo. For a premature baby it looks like Joseph has a darned good start in loving hands.) Note everybody how thorough Pauls research has been. Josephine was in the hospital two weeks and her baby was premature .... You don't get that kind of detail from drawing information out of thin air. Good work Paul.

I also loved the picture of the couple at Hawthorne and the article about her "jumping on the tractor". Josephine was a lady I think that I would have liked alot.

But look at the heartache. Losing the place that had been in the Brown family, the place where you were married.... where you spent your honeymoon, where you watched your baby grow . Oh my goodness. No wonder that little El Nido teapot meant alot to her!

A good solid chapter Paul. I can tell that its going toward .... mystery and heartache ... but its a good story. Victoria
Mark Culpepper
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tragic accidents

Post by Mark Culpepper »

Paul,

Someone once said that the numbers of "suicides" by "window flying" was greatly exaggeratedby the press in the late thirties. I submit that most were reported as a similar "accidents" (as "Uncle Orvilles" was.)

Small town newspapers, have you noticed? only print the "official" view. The only reason people in a small town bother to read the paper is to see if WHAT THEY KNOW HAPPENED was reported or reported accurately. Other than that the rumor mill has already spread the news. And I can just hear it now. "What an unfortunate accident" wink ...." such a pity" wink. "How the mighty have fallen" snide wink.

I speak from experience having grown up in a small town, The rumor mill is horrendous! I love my small town, but those are the facts.

And I chuckle at the way the paper phrases " alighting on his head" Now theres an interesting choice of words. A dove "alights " on a branch, not so a head from several stories! Much tweeking in that story! and I am sure everyone in Zanesville was saying ... those who bothered .... "Oh he jumped, dont you know!"

I just wonder how long it will take for the young couple to make their break, as most of us did.

I am like Victoria here. I can see that this story is going toward some heartache but I have a feeling of adventure too. Thanks for the last installment Paul. Another good paper.

Mark C.
twigsnapper
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tragic accident

Post by twigsnapper »

Paul, Victoria, Mark,

I certainly agree with you. Everyone should know that you can't believe everything that you read in a paper. And in a small town especially you have factors at work. Regard for the surviving family?, concern over the familys rath if you told the actual truth? But what would that be? "Uncle Orville leaned over perhaps. Was he thinking of jumping? Maybe, maybe not.

But if you have the two scenarios available to you as the editor and the publisher you pick the one that suits your purpose. And in this instance it was far better to choose the words " tragic accident" than to blare the word "suicide!" Its the way stories hit the press everyday.

Twigsnapper
Victoria Steele
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just so sad

Post by Victoria Steele »

Rereading that part about Hawthorne. Oh my goodness the amount of money the Browns must have sunk into the place. What was it? something like 12 new buildings, facilities for overnight! A dance hall, game rooms ... the beautiful pool and a restaurant! Where was this place Andrew when you started looking for your bed and breakfast resort! Darn. Separated by all those years! But I think that Dr. Brown had sort of the concept that you have generated. Perhaps he wasn't a very good businessman at it though. You know, trying to figure if a swim club during the depression was a good idea at all!

A tragedy having to sell at a loss! But why did that have to happen? Did the cost of building the place up put them so much in the hole? But I thought that the family had plenty of money? Couldn't they have weathered that financial storm? It seems like the Hawthorne property would have been the last to go .... unless .... it was? Did Townsends Father have the same financial problems that "Uncle Orville" had? If so maybe he was running on such a thin margin that the Hawthorne expenditures were the straw that broke the camels back. Its such a shame really. the teapot without a home! Victoria
Paul S.
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Re: just so sad

Post by Paul S. »

Victoria Steele wrote:Rereading that part about Hawthorne. Oh my goodness the amount of money the Browns must have sunk into the place. What was it? something like 12 new buildings, facilities for overnight! A dance hall, game rooms ... the beautiful pool and a restaurant!
The article I cited re: the offering at auction included a figure of $75,000 for improvements. I'm not sure why I left that particular figure out... that's whyt it's a "first draft, work-in-progress."

I have also learned that the "Hawthorne Pool" club truly only operated for "one short season," i.e. 1936, not the "one or two" seasons mentioned in the chapter; I left some wiggle room there because the actual dates are a tad slippery, but it now looks like 1936, only.
Where was this place Andrew when you started looking for your bed and breakfast resort! Darn.
Same place it's always been.... just outside of Zanesville. It is now known as "Armco Park," and is operated as a retreat for employees of Armco Steel Corp.
You know, trying to figure if a swim club during the depression was a good idea at all!
To say nothing of the seasonality in a place like central Ohio...
But I thought that the family had plenty of money? Couldn't they have weathered that financial storm? It seems like the Hawthorne property would have been the last to go .... unless .... it was?
The business about Uncle Orville was included because I think that gives us a good idea what happened to the Townsend Family Fortune during the Depression. And in those days, you were doing well if you could actuall sell real-estate, even at a loss.
Its such a shame really. the teapot without a home!
True, perhaps, a shame indeed but.... Linda recently told me that that she still has that teapot among her most treasured keepsakes, and she values it far beyond any value she could place on Hawthorne were it still in the family. So I think we should take our lead from her on what we find "value" in...

--PS
Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
LongboardLOVELY
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A deeper Draft vessel and a teapot

Post by LongboardLOVELY »

Paul,
I agree with Victoria that you're a very talented fellow who has done his research well. Is it foreshadowing how that teapot keeps popping up (pun intended) throughout this story?
Also, I am so amazed that no one has yet to address the first part of this chapter. Do I get to be the first? I read it for the first time this morning, and the first thing I did was call my hubby. I have a few observations for ya'all, and I'm sure Paul will want to chime in here.

1] I love puzzles. Here's one. Who in the world had the connection to contact a Senate Majority Leader who has been in Congress for four terms on TTBrown's behalf? This cannot possibly be the influence of his father and mother. You don't just pick up the phone and dial 411 to get the US Senate. And the SML is a very VERY important person.

2] Do ya'all know who this Joseph T. Robinson is!!!?? If you've studied history to any extent, you'll probably remember more than I do. This is what I recall. HE was a great friend and close CLOSE associate of President Franklin D. Roosevelt. As a matter of fact, they knew each other before President Roosevelt was President. JTR was a big influence on the development of the New Deal and the "Alphabet Reforms" agencies; two of which are major players in the telecommunications industry (TVA & FCC). Who else remembers anything about this fellow?

3] So this Robinson fellow has a hankering to keep our young Brown scientist who is studying communcations and gravitators in the Navy Labs. And when he wasn't successful in doin' so, did the relationship continue? Maybe in another form? Or in another place? With Other people? (capitalized 'O' on purpose)

Chew on that Victoria ! :P

Linda Bolland
Any fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage - to move in the opposite direction. ~ Albert Einstein
LongboardLOVELY
Junior Birdman
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Robinson and Brown

Post by LongboardLOVELY »

I forgot to mention also that

4] Senator Robinson throughout his Senate career promoted both the League of Nations and the Permanent Court of International Justice. the League of Nations of course is the precursor to our UN.

5] He's also the author of the Robinson-Patman Act, 1936.

This is no small time deal here. In 1933, Robinson was four years from his death. He had been in Congress for twenty years when he mentions Townsend Brown in a phone conversation to the Secretary of the Navy.


Hmmmm. Who was the influence?

Linda B. again
Any fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage - to move in the opposite direction. ~ Albert Einstein
Mark Culpepper
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following your lead

Post by Mark Culpepper »

Linda B.

What a great post! So following your learned lead I can see one possibility in a flash. And an obvious connection between Dr. Brown and what was happening here. William Stephenson . (The man who took Morgan sailing in 1965 along with Dr. Brown, The man who stepped on board the Caroline in 1933.)

It is obvious to me that Stephenson was briefing Johnson as to the state of the conditions in Europe, as well as meeting a possible new member. Dr. Brown just got to ride on a bigger boat but I think that the ride carried the same purpose as his trip with Morgan. The Caroline Group was recruiting!

William Stephenson was at one point very influential with FDR though it is difficult to find an actual accounting of it. So follow the communications connections with Mr. Eldridge Johnson. Follow Stephenson again as he sets up his "private intelligence agency" (The BSC) in New York City.

Linda, more input from you here PLEASE because you obviously know your stuff.

But to me it was obvious at the time that FDR realized that the country would eventually have to face the Germans in a war. His intelligence through Stephenson and Churchill was far too good, but the country would never have bought the idea. Isolationism was the flavor of the day and he probably would have been impeached if he had made any overt actions in that direction.

But that didn't stop the behind the scenes wheeling and dealing. And if "The Caroline Group"( as Paul has dubbed them) ,was interested in communications then they would definitely have been watching a man like Townsend Brown.

And you are right, you don't get that kind of attention from a SML by just picking up the phone. And note the URGENCY with which he pursued the subject. hardly a day passes between communications. Now that is worth noting too.

But the Navy didn't go for it, despite the urgings. I have a feeling that the "Caroline Group" does not simply give up. So WHAT HAPPENS NEXT PAUL? FASCINATING and HISTORICAL.... and thanks Linda for your astute observations. Mark C.
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Re: following your lead

Post by LongboardLOVELY »

Mark Culpepper wrote:Linda B.

What a great post! So following your learned lead I can see one possibility in a flash. And an obvious connection between Dr. Brown and what was happening here. William Stephenson

Thank you... I used to really like puzzle books in high school, and I enjoyed school enough to pay attention to the good teachers (good thing my government/econ/history teachers were so good.


Mark Culpepper wrote:Linda, more input from you here PLEASE because you obviously know your stuff.


I've ordered a few books from Barnes and Noble that will help evaluate this period of time. I am hoping it will put things in perspective for me.
Mark Culpepper wrote: His [Roosevelt] intelligence through Stephenson and Churchill was far too good, but the country would never have bought the idea. Isolationism was the flavor of the day and he probably would have been impeached if he had made any overt actions in that direction.
I remember that truism about isolationism. If it weren't for a few key people in Hawaii, we would never have joined the war.

Mark Culpepper wrote: And you are right, you don't get that kind of attention from a SML by just picking up the phone. And note the URGENCY with which he pursued the subject. hardly a day passes between communications. Now that is worth noting too.
I did note that. Great sense of urgency. ALMOST as if someone was seeing into the future for the need of an efficient communications network that had far reaching capabilities. Was this Senator in the know about things going behind the scenes in Germany? Did he have special input from the private sector as to the need of a "genius scientist" in communciations?
Mark Culpepper wrote:But the Navy didn't go for it, despite the urgings. I have a feeling that the "Caroline Group" does not simply give up. So WHAT HAPPENS NEXT PAUL? FASCINATING and HISTORICAL.... and thanks Linda for your astute observations. Mark C.
You're welcome. More babbling to come later.

LRB
Any fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage - to move in the opposite direction. ~ Albert Einstein
Annemarie
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documents

Post by Annemarie »

Wasn't it Stephenson who was quoted as saying "never trust documents'
(Mainlly because he was an expert at disinformation for the English against the Germans. He knew that public information channels could be manipulated. Things that seem to be the truth can be the truth...... without telling the whole story.

A personal story to illustrate the point. I lost my father to a heart attack on a Friday 13th .... close to midnight. I am in the medical field, He died on the way to the hospital. I knew it ... the paramedics knew it. He was gone.

When we finally arrived at the hospital the attending physician looked at the clock and wrote the time ..... now well after midnight on the 14th.

Now the point is this. On his tombstone is the wrong date. On his death certificate was the wrong date. And for years I realized that I was the only one who knew this. The 14th of that year was Valentines Day. A better date to remember perhaps than Firday 13th ... so I never made any efforts toward corrections. But you see, a simple lesson in how agendas can actually alter history. Even in a family.

And I know enough about William Stephenson to wonder what the REAL story is about that missing finger? I don't think its what it seemed to be.
Annemarie
twigsnapper
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stories never told

Post by twigsnapper »

Paul,


Some stories are just never meant to be told. Some are. Most of the time you never really know which is which. And some are like Annemaries story above, unless you were actually there, I expect that you will never know the truth.

I have a similar story to tell. You might call it a marker. The lives of the people that you are investigating are not at all what they generally thought that they were getting into when they "signed up" But sometimes a rare one comes along that seems to know from the very start what his destiny is meant to be. A destiny that does not necessarily mean what he had dreamed for himself, or dreamed but never understood.

My story is short. Use it or not. Recognize it or not. Three men had taken a prisoner. They had tied him to a chair. He had been there a long time and now was unconcious. The one terrorist spoke of killing the man right there. He aimed but the bullet never found its mark. At least his bullet never found its mark. A series of three rapid shots , one right on top of the other and the three men dropped where they had been standing. The shooter came out of the shadows , unlocked the door from the inside, turned to a companion who had just joined him and said ... "lets get him out of here. " Who was this man? Someone destined for the job that he just accomplished." And you know who he was Paul.

Twigsnapper
Victoria Steele
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screen play

Post by Victoria Steele »

Twigsnapper,

OK now you have me totally confused. Thats a screenplay, right? Its interesting, but what does it have to do with the story that Paul is writing? I guess that you are making a point, huh? and I am just not in on it. Its OK. I'm used to being the girl on the other side of the boys club house.

Its sort of a haunting story Twigsnapper, whatever your reason in telling it.

Victoria
Paul S.
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Re: screen play

Post by Paul S. »

Victoria Steele wrote:Its interesting, but what does it have to do with the story that Paul is writing? I guess that you are making a point, huh? and I am just not in on it. Its OK. I'm used to being the girl on the other side of the boys club house.
Oh, no, Victoria, you're hardly alone on the othe side of the club house. This club is genuinely "co-ed."

That story... the way it has been told... is totally consistent with a typical day in the Parallel Universe.

Welcome to my world.

--PS
Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
twigsnapper
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but its a good world

Post by twigsnapper »

Ah, Paul. It may be confusing but its a good world and you will help make it better.

I am paying homage tonight to a great man and I know that not many of you have ever heard his name.( Perhaps Raymond and his contacts in France.) His name was Raymond Triboulet and he died on Friday. Nearly made it to 100 he did. A funny, brave man. He was responsible for helping the French hang on to the provincial government control after the war, had worked in the resistance but then as the Allies liberated France he was asked to devise a system which would maintain control for the French. I hope you don't mind, I'd like to guote a couple of things that he is credited with saying.

"We had to give the Allies the impression that we were in control. I requisitoned all the motorcycles I could find and told some brave people to follow the troops and as each community was freed they were to find a guy who wasn't too dumb and make him the mayor!" (Hey, a fly by the seat of your pants plan, but it worked!)

Later he was elected to Parliament and became the veterans administrator. He was the fellow who pushed the law through the national assembly which made D Day an annual commemorated event. Of course in the years since he had been nearly totally ignored for his participation both in the war and for making that day a marked event. Which he accepted with grace if not a twist of irony.

He had something else to say about "rough men" who are there while "others slept" and before I get too roundly criticised for telling that violent little story earlier, I'd like to mention his warning. Then you folks can talk about it ,maybe, and perhaps even think about it a little. I will leave you now because I think that I need to stand somewhere at the edge of a crowd as this great man is put to rest.

He said " Young people need to know that peace grows out of the barrel of a gun, become weak and you will be invaded and all the peaceful intentions in the world won't change that."

Twigsnapper
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