Two units, sending/receiving

A place to engage extended discussions of things that come up on the ttbrown.com website. Anything goes here, as long as it's somehow pertinent to the subject(s) at hand.
wdavidb
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Post by wdavidb »

First thing I want to do is make a couple of points clear.............

I myself am not working on building a electrogravitic communicator or any other such devise, this is something Jim is hoping he can find someone to work on.

I have neither the resources or a place to do such work.......

Another thing I want to make clear, I might say there are things wrong with out modern science but that is not meant to insult anyone or degrade their achievements, on the contrary I have the greatest respect for anyone who is truly a student of the universe. In my opinion we are all children attempting to understand universe, so we explore ideas and sometimes we actually get something right.
Last edited by wdavidb on Fri Dec 15, 2006 7:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
Elizabeth Helen Drake
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all students here

Post by Elizabeth Helen Drake »

You are absolutely right David. We are all students here and we all seem to be invested with different gifts, ALL OF WHICH ARE IMPORTANT.

Personally discussions of quantum vaccuum and things similar just leave my mind in the dirt! But still I believe somehow I can be a help ...... even if all I get to say occasionally is " boys, boys" ...... (it could have been "girls-girls" we have the ladies here who have the brainpower to get into that kind of intellectual food fight.)

Quite frankly I am not sure WHY I am here. but I wouldn't miss being along for all of this for anything. I am sure that you are all helping Paul enormously in sharpening his wits ..... just as the information he is bringing out is helping us sharpen ours. And isn't that what his banner statement is? The phrase that Paul has at the beginning of this effort.
" The Universe is filled with magical things, patiently waiting for your wits to grow sharper."

Trickfox. The information we shared about the "Xerox Park" was interesting. I thought later, was that arrangement sort of like the " Tuxedo Park" set up by Alfred Loomis? Would I be right? Elizabeth
wdavidb
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Post by wdavidb »

Now on to the speed of gravity, light years and the rest of it............

What is the simultaneous condition of universe?

This includes all that is past and all that is future, which is everying beyond the relative limitations of the non-absolute present moment.

Beyond the present moment time and space do not exist as both the past and future exist simultaneously as a simultaneous condition remaining relative to the present moment.

As you would all realize, time as we consider it is a linear system of time keeping, resulting from an abstract human invention intended for the purpose of social and business organization. A system invented for the sake of convenience. So in effect there is no such thing as an actual second, minute or hour.

No two seconds are of the same absolute duration, which throws a bit of a wrench into the works when we start talking about millionths of degrees of accuracy, as each of the millionths of degrees are of a slightly different duration, and the more accuracy you attempt to instill into the situation the less accurate the result.

Yet, on the basis of this linear time keeping we have conjectured the existence of light years, right down to the length of time it takes light to travel one meter in a vacuum, which is said to be exactly 1/299,792,458ths of a second.

But we ignore the simple fact that no two meters are of the same absolute length, while we profess to know the exact speed of light and the exact length of a light year.

Then we make the assumption that light itself travels through space much like a train or bus, whereby it takes the light from distant star systems millions and billions of years to reach us.

The only way this could possibly work would be if time and space remained static whereby time and space could be measured using static terms of reference.

Hmmmm, doesn't sound right does it.

Something very wrong here, because the universe is dynamic. So how could you have static terms defining a dynamic state?

It seems rather strange that Einstein's relativity theories were based on a static concept of universe, and even though we know full well the universe is not static we still persist in accounting for the dimensions of universe by employing static terms of reference.

So what is space?

Space is a dynamic condition of field, nothing more or less. Change the condition of field and you change the dimensions of space.

Light of course is a condition of field and does not operate or function independent of the field in which it is observed to exist.

This would suggest that light is not in linear motion like a train or bus, but is in fact in non-linear motion corresponding to the condition of field remaining relative to the system of reference. Therefore the speed of light is different for every system of reference and on top of this the speed of light is dynamic. So to say the speed of light is exactly this or that is a self defeating exercise, as it blinds us to the true nature of universe.

I have heard scientists talking about the fabulous pictures they took of remote and distant galaxies as they existed so many billions of years ago.

Wow, you can see for billions of years simply by looking through a telescope? What am I missing?

Sorry guys there are no millions and billions of years, its a mind twist or a mind game intended to hold the framework of our theoretical concepts together.

If you can take a picture of something that happened a million years ago surely you can take a picture of something that happened yesterday....no?

So what you see is what you see because its there to see. It's not a question of light years or astro units..............the light does not come down and hit you in the eye............you see stars where they are..in the sky.

Remember the universe is expanding at an accelerative rate and the rate of expansion has been calculated to be close to or beyond the speed of light at the outer boundary of universe. So if the field is expanding at close to the speed of light how is it that you can even see it?

Oh boy, this is wild stuff.................because the universe is expanding away from us. And if this is the case how is it that light is radiating towards us at the speed of light, while still maintaining the spatial dimensions of space in terms of a linear format?

As gravity itself is not a force of any kind and is simply a dynamic response to the condition of field, we could just as easily dispense with gravity altogether. We know that gravitational acceleration is different for every system of reference, so is the acceleration of gravity simply an expression of the field acceleration in terms of a underlying force remaining relative to the point of reference?

So, because both past and future are simultaneous conditions of universe and because the present moment is of a non-absolute duration gravity is instantaneous in all directions relative to the system of reference.

This would mean that the instantaneous communication of gravity would be the same either coming or going as no space or time is involved in the simultaneous condition of universe.

So the communication is in fact through the field and not gravity per se. It is the field in terms of a simultaneous conditon of field that allows for simultaneous communication.

Einstein referred to this as spooky............which indeed it is. This is why ESP has been the subject of so many black programs, because ESP involves simultaneous communication. And the thinking goes,...if we can nail down ESP we'll get the rest of it.

A good strategy I'm sure, but it does not bring you any closer to an understanding of field dynamics.

I think its time to drop gravity because gravity is a mask which hides the face of the field........or the color of the horse.

Only time will tell..................spooky........?

Time is a force..........the only force of universe. ...so time tells alright. It tells us all we want to know..........in relation to a non-linear concept of time. Non-linear time field frequency acceleration, the best I can do for a descriptive label.

NASA has spent 50m trying to figure out why Pioneer 10 &11 are slowing in deep space and they still don't know why.

The field is accelerating symmetrically to the core and the further you go away from the core the slower is the field effect, so the slowing is due to a differential in field dynamics existing between the two Pioneers and the earth. Do I get 50m now? Haha...........

Our field is accelerating, which means the days are still 24 hours, but 24 hours is not what it was last week or last year or a hundred years ago.

In fact time is now accelerating fast enough that we are starting to notice a slight difference. But it can only get worse, because that's how acceleration works.

Space is a condition not a thing..........its not like string.

The measure of space is not something we can nail down because it keeps changing faster than we can measure it, because the units of measure are themselves changing as is the space we are attempting to measure.

And we have barely started to talk.........or even walk.
Last edited by wdavidb on Fri Dec 15, 2006 11:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
Trickfox
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Yup

Post by Trickfox »

Elizabeth
That's XEROX PARC http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerox_Parc

I believe that you are quite correct on that. I just learned about tuxedo park recently myself in this forum, and I do think that perhaps there is another PARC comming around the corner.......

I wonder if there is a Park near Osoyoos lake!.....

Hey David you live near the Okanogan valley. Steve apparently lives there too. When you guys get together to chat about your unity project, do you meet up at Steve's place or you end up on Salt Springs Island?

David, I like your outlook on things, and Jim is a Mac person so I immediatly identify with the man. I think the both of you are highly valued and appreciated in this forum, and I hope Steve can eventually tell us about himself too.

Perhaps Alexander can chime in here too. This is a great place for chewing the fat and as long as everyone respects everyone else, we find that the more we talk together the more it seems like we have been drawn together to accomplish some sort of task. At least that's how I feel.

Trickfox
The psychopropulsier (as pointed out in the book The Good-bye man by Linda Brown and Jan Lofton) is a Quantum entanglement project under development using Quantum Junctions. Join us at http://www.Peeteelab.com
wdavidb
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Post by wdavidb »

The last time I was at Osoyoos Lake, I do think there is a park there or a least there was.

Steve and I talk on the web via Gizmo, but we have not actually met in person...........the same with Jim. And as far as Alex goes, I don't even want to go there, that is not my cup of tea at all.

Now, how did I end up on Salt Spring Island............sort of like falling down a rabbit hole, or attempting to escape the madness of the world.

Finding a place to be who you are without having to explain what that is.

On an island there is only one way off and one way on and that is across the water, so it is a little like being in a castle with a moat.

It's quiet, peaceful for the most part and stimulating to the senses and the mind. Does life get any better than this?
Mikado14
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experiments

Post by Mikado14 »

wdavidb wrote:Now on to the speed of gravity, light years and the rest of it............
....................................................................................................................Space is a condition not a thing..........its not like string.

The measure of space is not something we can nail down because it keeps changing faster than we can measure it, because the units of measure are themselves changing as is the space we are attempting to measure.

And we have barely started to talk.........or even walk.
Just asking a simple question, What experiments or methods of validation have you performed to come to the conclusions you have posted? Or is this conjecture of hypothesis based on collected observations? Or is it something entirely different?

Mikado
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy
Elizabeth Helen Drake
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feels right

Post by Elizabeth Helen Drake »

How I interpret your last message Mikado is that there might be something BEYOND the things that you are asking David. Something perhaps more ... intuitive ... as in .... you come to a conclusion and it is NOT based on all of the rational things that others require.

Remember here folks we are in a rabbit hole and the other rules don't necessarily apply . So does anyone want to talk about the process that SEEMS to be there where a person makes a "connection" with something that relays the information? But there is no way in this world that can ever be explained without going to ESP.

One wonders then if thats a possibility. If not .... why would no less a luminary personage in the quantum research world as Dr. Hal Puthoff investigate that avenue? Anybody want to talk in that direction. Dr. Puthoff if you happen to be reading this, hello. Elizabeth
Mikado14
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Re: feels right

Post by Mikado14 »

Elizabeth Helen Drake wrote:How I interpret your last message Mikado is that there might be something BEYOND the things that you are asking David. Something perhaps more ... intuitive ... as in .... you come to a conclusion and it is NOT based on all of the rational things that others require.
I plead the fifth. I am only looking for a baseline to start.

Mikado
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy
Elizabeth Helen Drake
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baseline?

Post by Elizabeth Helen Drake »

Mikado,

A baseline? As in "common ground? .... starting point? Did I translate that right? Or are you meaning something else?

Elizabeth
Mikado14
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Re: baseline?

Post by Mikado14 »

Elizabeth Helen Drake wrote:Mikado,

A baseline? As in "common ground? .... starting point? Did I translate that right? Or are you meaning something else?

Elizabeth
Something else. Come on Elizabeth, you really know me better than that, even after only a few months on here. <g>.

Mikado
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy
Elizabeth Helen Drake
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visionaries

Post by Elizabeth Helen Drake »

I noted David that someone on your website, or pertaining to it (yes, I TRY to do my homework) referred to you as a "Visionary" and I had to smile a little because that name is sometimes applied to someone when no one knows how else to describe that person! Frankly I rather like the word! And your input is great, even if it is going to take me some time to really get the gist of it.

If you and Jim and Steve have actually never met, then does that hold the same for Alexander Frolov too? Forgive me if I am being dense here but I detected a slight negativity in your statement " not my cup of tea" Around here its Earl Grey (Townsend Browns favorite) .... but seriously ... is there some discord between you? and if there is, can you share that with us? either openly or by PM? I would appreciate that because I don't want to make any incorrect assumptions here. Elizabeth
wdavidb
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Post by wdavidb »

Elizabeth...........sent you a message, hope it answers your questions.

Okay.............at least I see the problem we have.

It's a simple question of mathematics and numbers, because we are attempting to mix apples and oranges with bananas and it makes things a bit difficult.

How can a static term be applied to a dynamic state?

If you want to measure something you have to have the appropriate terms clearly understood. And if the terms do not apply to the specific application, involving a process of measuring, your calculations are going to prove less than accurate.

So when we use seconds and meters we are using static terms, in relation to an abstract idea concerning the duration of a second and the length of a meter rule.

Unfortunately no two seconds are of the same absolute duration and no two meter rules are of the same absolute length, which most people know to be true but choose to ignore. This in my opinion is a basic error, which presents us with a very unsatisfactory picture of the situation we are attempting to evaluate.

On top of this we assume far too much, such as the constancy of light speed and the possibility that light might be capable of being in motion independent of an underlying force.

In fact, our modern science does not allow for an underlying force, as it is assumed that such a force is not required.

Therefore we think in terms of linear proportions, such as light years and AU without realizing that we are in fact fooling ourselves into accepting something as fact which is mathematically impossible.

If we go no further than considering the non-absolute nature of the terms employed and consider the dynamic nature of universe we will have moved the marker forward in a substantial manner.

For example: let us consider the historical experiment where it was confirmed that light passing in close proximity to the sun was bent by the space curve of the solar mass.

In this case it is assumed that the light does in fact pass in close proximity to the sun, but is this even necessary to observe the described effect?

No, as it is only necessary to observe a shift in the position of the distant star situated beyond the sun.

So what could have happened other than what is assumed to have happened?

No underlying force is considered and no non-linear dynamics are considered, but if they were we would get a completely different view of the situation.

If we consider that there is a non-uniform differential in the underlying force affecting the condition of the sun and the condition of the earth we will see that there this non-uniform differential increase in the direction of the sun. So the place where we will notice the greatest observable difference is close to the surface curve of the sun.

So, it might be possible for us to consider that what we are viewing is a distortional effect associated with a non-uniform differential in dynamic potential. And in this respect we are viewing a field distortion affecting our field of view, which does not require light to be in linear motion or for the distant light to pass close to the sun.

Therefore gravity has nothing to do with it, as this is simply a field effect, which we will discover is different when viewed from other systems constituting our solar system.

We view universe from our point of reference, which is planet earth.

We exist within the field of the earth and are subject to the relative limitations of the earth's field. And even if we travel into space by means of rockets or some other linear based system we do not leave the field of the earth as to do so would require us to shift to another field conditon, which is presently beyond our ability.

If you read what I have to say about the tests to which the returned lunar samples were subjected you will see that a non-uniform differential is more than just an idea, but unfortunately NASA has since chosen to sensore those test results and deny the existence of a non-uniform relationship.

I have no control over what NASA does or doesn't do, but I have written many letters to various departments involved in future manned missions to the moon and mars pointing out the dangers of exposing mission crew to exterrestrial materials, whether in the form of gases, liquids or solids. To date I am ignored, but having witnessed the results first hand I do know what I am talking about.

Back in 1970 I had speculated that lunar material would affect accelerated growth in plants, which I thought might be of some help in attempting to feed the world in a more efficient manner, but what I did not count on was the actual results. Yes, accelerated growth in plants was documented but the factor of non-uniformity also caused radical genetic deformities and cancer, which I had not anticipated.

At the time no one knew what to make of this and it was a baffling mystery, but despite the total lack of understanding at the time I made the decision to forge on and promised myself that I would get to the bottom of it, which I did.

Now it is a state secret............which leaves me out in the cold.

Accelerated growth of plants occurs here on earth when the plants are cultivated deep underground and the rate of accelerated growth increases with depth...........at 1400 meters you have better than a 400% increase in the rate of growth with a completely uniform increase in the cellular dynamics of the plants involved, whereby when replanted to surface sites they are more resistant to a variety of disease normally affecting each species of plant.

It may appear that plants don't have much to do with the task at hand but they present a fresh view of the dynamics involved.

We are at a point in history where we either move forward or we fall back, and I think forward is the rational choice.
Mikado14
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Post by Mikado14 »

wdavidb wrote: Back in 1970 I had speculated that lunar material would affect accelerated growth in plants, which I thought might be of some help in attempting to feed the world in a more efficient manner, but what I did not count on was the actual results. Yes, accelerated growth in plants was documented but the factor of non-uniformity also caused radical genetic deformities and cancer, which I had not anticipated.

At the time no one knew what to make of this and it was a baffling mystery, but despite the total lack of understanding at the time I made the decision to forge on and promised myself that I would get to the bottom of it, which I did.

Now it is a state secret............which leaves me out in the cold.
I take it from your post that you worked directly or via a subcontractor with NASA? If not, whom did you speculate to?

Just curious,

Mikado
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy
wdavidb
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Post by wdavidb »

Mikado,

I was, at the time, corresponding with NASA, but did not work for them and yes I did offer my contributions at times.

It was due to this informal relationship that they showed me what they had and I was completely blown away, surprised is not the right word.

This in itself should have sent everyone back to the drawing board to start anew, but of course this did not happen. It was business as usual despite the formidable obstacles that had now raised their ugly heads.

It was years later that I was to discover that during the interm the original work had been deleted and had been put into the denial mode. At first I simply could not believe it and thought it was just a matter of crossed wires, but sure enough it had all been deleted, even though this information was available to the public during the early 70s.

Of course it is now argued that the astronauts inhaled the lunar dust on the return trip from the moon with no ill effects, not even a cough.

The puzzle to all this is that this material should have had similar effects on the astronauts, but evidently it did not............or consider this possibility......there was another crew that no one ever got to hear about.

The strangeness to all this is that someone or something recovered the lunar material and returned it to earth. The Russians used robotics to recover their lunar material.

So there are a lot of unanswered questions about the Apollo Missions.

It seems strange that NASA has lost the original footage of the Appolo Missions.........but there was also footage of the experiments conducted.

As well there were a lot of still photos and pages of data.........who knows where all that ended up.......but the catalogue references to the tests have also been deleted.

I have advertised extensively for any information out there on the testing of the lunar material, but so far nothing. Of course I would be willing to pay for material relating to the experiments conducted on plants and animals....but all that is available is new material which has been created to cover the original work......which is not very helpful.
Mikado14
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Post by Mikado14 »

wdavidb wrote:Mikado,

I was, at the time, corresponding with NASA, but did not work for them and yes I did offer my contributions at times.
wdavidb,

Thanks for your response. I worded the last part of my question wrong, instead of "whom did you speculate to", it should have read, whom did you speculate for?

In other words, who were you working for?

Or perhaps a better question would be, Who were you working for that NASA would consider listening to your contributions?

Trying to get a handle on where you are coming from, in other words, Simple question, simple answer, thanks.

Mikado
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy
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