Chapter 32: Reflections on Biscayne Bay

Use this section for any discussion specifically related to the chapters posted online of the unfolding biography, "Defying Gravity: The Parallel Universe of T. Townsend Brown
Paul S.
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Chapter 32: Reflections on Biscayne Bay

Post by Paul S. »

Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
Victoria Steele
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No going home again

Post by Victoria Steele »

Paul ..... I don't even know what to say.

I am ..... shell shocked .......... not only by the words ..... but by the IMPLICATION ....... and the feeling down deep in my body ...... that this is the TRUTH. This actually happened ........ I hardly know what to say. I'll return to this topic , you can be sure .... but seeing all of this from Morgans eyes .... whew ..... thats powerful stuff .....Victoria
Last edited by Victoria Steele on Thu Apr 20, 2006 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Paul S.
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Sometimes the Story Tells Itself

Post by Paul S. »

Yeah, I kinda a thought that a "first hand account" would dispel any doubt about the veracity of the stories being told. I felt like a bit of a cop out, just re-writing somebody else's words instead of embellishing with my own but... sometimes, the most important thing a writer can do is just get out of the way.

--PS
Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
Mark Culpepper
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No words appropriate

Post by Mark Culpepper »

You know, I thought that you couldn't surprise me. I knew that you were going into mysterious territory but I have been there before and I didn't think that you would come up with material that I hadn't at least HEARD BEFORE. But this is entirely a surprise.

One of the newer members of this forum (Hello Dr. Jordan) made the comment that your work had the potential to "blow the socks off people". Hell, I can't even find my socks. I can't even find where I was standing before I read that chapter. I am ...... blown away .....

And I seem not to be the only one. Victoria is speechless. Now I have harbored a great admiration for that lady. I have never met her but damn ... she doesn't take guff from anyone and I admire that kind of vocal ability. But SHE IS SPEECHLESS. I can't wait to see what she has to say when she recovers from the shock.

Paul. You KNOW HOW GOOD THIS IS .... DON'T YOU? YOU HAVE TO KNOW HOW VERY GOOD THIS IS? This is major BIG TIME ....... Mark C.
Madison
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mystical connections

Post by Madison »

Paul,

I am sure that sometime in the future , I at lease HOPE, sometime in the future mankind will look upon the way this book unfolded for you and realize the WAY that it happened.

But for now all I can do is appreciate that it seems to be happening. As you said , you didn't plan this particular chapter , it seems to have sort of "put itself together" but isn't that the way that inspiration really works? I don't think anyone ever has b een able to PROVE that INSPIRATION EXISTS but we all know that it does. If we had to PROVE why and how great men see things .... before we appreciate and take note of those things .... this would not be the world it is.

We may not yet understand the "force that we call inspiration" as well as I think Doctor Brown and Morgan came to understand it . But we can still see that force at work here, and appreciate it. And .... whew .... what a story this is going to make!

Taking a week break? You deserve it! But don't forget us! Madison
Paul S.
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The Source of "Inspiration"

Post by Paul S. »

Madison wrote: isn't that the way that inspiration really works? I don't think anyone ever has b een able to PROVE that INSPIRATION EXISTS but we all know that it does. If we had to PROVE why and how great men see things .... before we appreciate and take note of those things .... this would not be the world it is.
Thank you, Madison, for your support, encouragement, and kind words. .

Years ago, in maybe the only writing class I ever took, I learned something very important about "inspiration."

I think the common misconception is "when we are inspired, we will work."

It doesn't work that way. The way it really works is

"when we work, we will be inspired."

The inspiration comes from doing the work, not the other way around. You keep your head down and nose to the grind stone long enough, and only then will the inspiration you seek finally appear to you.

This last chapter is definitely proof of that. But, of course, I'm already perseverating over the next chapter... :wink: Must work... must work... Fingers don't fail me now!

--PS
Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
Mark Culpepper
The Dean
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way inspiration works

Post by Mark Culpepper »

I noted that what you said about inspiration ... is very similar to what the Dali Lama said in a recent visit to the United States. I guess someone asked him if he would help with the process of developing a program which would bring waring factions of humanity together. He said something like .... You lead .... and then when we get to the goal ..... I can show you a future path. "

I guess that might not have made too much sense to those around him at the time but when I read it and then I just read what Madison and you had to say about inspiration and the work involved ...... I realized thats what he meant. We have to do the work to get the inspiration to take us further. It doesn't help to pray for guidence and inspiration .... if you are not already working in that direction. When you work ..... then it somehow ..... joins you. Am I making sense to anybody out there? Mark C"
Chris Knight
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Post by Chris Knight »

Time travel.

If Morgan were to go back and save his sister, then perhaps he would not have left home and ended up where he was at the time he was having the conversation with Mr. Brown.

Or is time more like a self-correcting river - if I throw a rock into the water, will the ripples continually exist, or will the natural course of the flow of water gradually incorporate the effects of the disturbance and continue on its way.

If I were to go back to just after my brother was born, and make sure that his severe vitamin deficiency was avoided, would he have grown larger and more self-confident, leading to him looking out for me rather than the reverse. Would I have grown up more subdued, less agressive? Would I be here today. How much difference can one make in the past?

Possibility and permissibility are two different concepts. Is it possible to travel back through time, and what are the "natural laws" that would constrain ones actions. Perhaps one would only be allowed to observe.

And if one were able to travel into the future, would it be possible to change something in the future - being there when it happened, since the future may not be as immutable as the past. Would the same natural laws allow effects to be permanently incorporated until the "present" caught up with it?

I do know that my answer to Brown's question to Morgan regarding the prohibition of certain actions by natural laws would have been the same.

Andrew
Paul S.
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Gonna Go Back In Time... (Huey Lewis)

Post by Paul S. »

Chris Knight wrote:If Morgan were to go back and save his sister, then perhaps he would not have left home and ended up where he was at the time he was having the conversation with Mr. Brown....Is it possible to travel back through time, and what are the "natural laws" that would constrain ones actions. Perhaps one would only be allowed to observe.
These issues were addressed in a recent issue of "New Sceintist" magazine:

No paradox for time travellers

http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns? ... 625044.300

The money quote:

"Now, physicists Daniel Greenberger of the City University of New York and Karl Svozil of the Vienna University of Technology in Austria have shown that the most basic features of quantum theory may ensure that time travellers could never alter the past, even if they are able to go back in time."

Basically, the idea is that if you could go back and alter the time line, then you might not have been here to go back in the first place.

BTW, anybody remember the name of Christopher Lloyd's time-travelling character in the "Back to the Future" movies??

--PS
Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
Trickfox
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Time for more another provocative thought experiment.

Post by Trickfox »

OK,...Dr. Brown was serious so NOW, you have my complete attention.

The subject of time travel "being possible" has been a continuing thought experiment for me for the past ten years. It continues to be my foremost preoccupation as of this date.

I am not the least bit surprized with Dr. Brown's answer. I am only surprized that he did not complete the answer the way I now see it. Time travel IS and IS NOT possible at the same time. I depends totally upon an individual's actual "timeline reference".

Let me explain this the way I understand it. If you travel BACK in time you end up changing your own subjective timeline to a degree which should be conjunctional to the amount of time you spend exploring your own subjective timeline.

The more time you spend exploring your subjective past timeline, the more chances you have of causing paradoxes within your own subjective timeline.

These paradoxes would likely cause your own personnal timeline "Quantum wave" to collapse abruptly resulting in your own death.

If this is the case, then there might only be a single way of travelling back safely. I submit that the only way to do so would be the way that any of us could probably be doing it right now.

The method I have called "the hiccup" describes the only logical method of travelling back in time to gently divert the timeline towards a more desirable outcome.

The "hiccup" occurs as a "subtle momentary diversion". A "Freudian slip". A sudden moment of "déja-vue". A "double take".

These similar experiences are probably the only logical method of travelling BACK "SAFELY" in time. Any more profound time spent in one's own past subjective timeline would surely cause the quantum wave to collapse rather than divert towards a new time trajectory.

Now comes the interesting part:

If you decide to want to be able to travel BACK in time to cause hiccups in your own timeline, then you must allready have chosen an anticipated future timeline.

By now you are all saying "DUH.... what did he say?".

What I said amounts to this. YOU MUST TRAVEL FOWARD IN TIME TO BE ABLE TO TRAVEL BACK IN TIME!!!

In other words, you have to anticipate a successfull future to aim at, -so that you will be able to come back from that future to correct your own path towards that future.

"The present" seems to confirm this issue.

If you are confident that you are controlling your own timeline from the future, then every little hiccup that occurs that forces you to change your agenda might either be a mistake or it's CAUSED by your own future influence and therefore it was meant to be as such.

So when it happens that you push on the wrong button too quickly, -then remember TO ASK YOURSELF, was it a mistake?, or was it a message from the future?

(if you could all see me laughing right now you would know exactly how crazy the trickfox is)

None of you may believe this but I think I have invented a device to help individuals do precisely this. (travel back from a desirable future to correct an ongoing timeline towards that desired future)

I call it a "Psychopropulsor", and at this very moment I'm having trouble getting a copyright on the actual term "Psychopropulsor" because the CFR requres me to provide an actual explanation as to how a single quantum Galium Arsenide semiconductor gate works to send a message from future to past.

In other words, I am unable to use the explanation that my "Psychoproplsor" can actually be a type of communications device. I must describe it as a "toy" or prove the math function first, then declare the breakthrough.

Since I have allready seen the future, I am probably here from the future and this excercise is likely to be my chosen path.

All I have to say now is; THANK YOU DR. BROWN. I am here because of you.

By the way "Defying gravity MEANS defying time itself". Mess with Gravity and you are messing with time.

Trickfox
The psychopropulsier (as pointed out in the book The Good-bye man by Linda Brown and Jan Lofton) is a Quantum entanglement project under development using Quantum Junctions. Join us at http://www.Peeteelab.com
Chris Knight
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Post by Chris Knight »

Thanks for the comments, Trickfox.

Oh, and Doc Brown, of course :)

Andrew
Elizabeth Helen Drake
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gettting notes from the future

Post by Elizabeth Helen Drake »

Dr. Brown seemed to be sayings to Morgan that going back to save his sister was against some kind of natural law. And I can see the workable wisdom of that. Obviously Morgan became the man he was because of his sisters death. To save her .... would have changed his entire path. Seeing a reflection of the fact that Dr. Brown SAW that natural law ..... well .... thats impressive to me.

Someone else said in these messages that a mountain is still a mountain ... whether or not you have ever seen that mountain has no bearing on the fact that it exists..... or the fact that there might be a "road in time, which goes both ways"

So ... as these natural laws are probably. Just because we have not been aware of this "dusty road that goes in both directions" does not mean that it can not exist. We as humans know very little, I think of the world around us. We just THINK we know alot.

But I do know one thing about people. They love to consider the possibilities .... at least those blessed with a sort of embedded passion for knowledge ... they have a NEED TO KNOW ..... and eventually I hope that we will be able to see that "road" and even understand it a little bit more about it. And it wouldn't surprise me to find that it had been a travelled path .... Elizabeth
Victoria Steele
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needs not to know

Post by Victoria Steele »

Everybody.

I need to just be quiet mentally for awhile and (like the computer in Red October that the sparks said had "run home to Mama!" ....( went back to something that it was familiar with .... after being faced with something that was beyond its understanding)

So mentally for awhile, forgive me ... I have "run home to Mama"

Romance. Love ... thats what I want to talk about for awhile.

And Dr. Brown said to Morgan ...."She needs NOT TO KNOW"

Oh crap..... things are not going to go well. I sense heartache coming down the pike and I know its not going to be just a one way street. I do believe that Morgan has been falling in love with her .... Don't know if he ever proclaimed it and maybe at the time he didn't even know ..... but "She NEEDS NOT TO KNOW. Pretty well spells it out. Their paths are going to go in separate directions and my heart aches for her because .... well, just because. Victoria
Gabriel
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TimeTravel

Post by Gabriel »

Wow great new chapter Paul. I think this sums up everything. Imagine time travel. I think this may be among other things something that Brown discovered and could share it with anyone. Morgan must have been honored to have learned this first hand but I think Brown knew that maybe in the future certain people would be given this tool and ablity to protect mankind and shape things in the future for the future. I believe life is about choices we make that affects the future by our actions done now. We can't change things already done but our choices lead to a series of interlinking events that unfold in the future. The question remains do you go and simply observe or do you use it for selfish motives such as money and power. I believe that these "controling unknowns" have tried to manipulate and change things for their own advantages in order to enslave man. Most people today that I know would laugh and say it is impossible to time travel. (It just doesn't fit their mind frame) Others would use it to destroy themsleves and others would use it for the good and betterment of mankind. I guess for those who are able to understand it are the one's who will benefit the most. Like trickfox said for those who believe and understand will be made better but for those who can't see or understand its explination they will be left in the dust. Quite simply it will challange the average joe to question the world around him. But the real question is will he be able to rise above his TV, football, and beer, and even care to investiagte the possiblites that Brown proposed to man. I guess the line from the Matrix sums it up. "Free your mind" Gabe
Elizabeth Helen Drake
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much to consider

Post by Elizabeth Helen Drake »

Gabe, what a nice, thoughtful message. Thankyou for your input.

I just want to respond to your consideration of the phrase "controlling unknown. I realize that single phrase might mean many different things to as many different people. As I can see your use of it ... sort of the controlling human social/government structure .... where people are pulling other peoples strings and the puppets don't even have enough awareness to know that this is happening or that they are in fact puppets.

Very valid look ....... but in this project I have learned that this whole "controlling unknown" concept is like a giant onion. with the outside peel knowing the least. And sometimes each layer of onion skin doesn't even recognize the fact that there is another more hidden than it, right beside it. Each "controlling unknown" believes it is actually in controll when in fact .... there is another right under it ..... and another under that.

I have a tendency to become rather mystical when considering the absolutely center of that onion. And I am hoping that at the center .... there is good . Thats my choice.

Other things to say but I just wanted to comment on that first. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Elizabeth
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